Cleveland Rocks Wal-Mart
Rep. Sherrod Brown (D-OH) launched a new web page detailing Wal-Mart’s business practices. The effort coincides with hearings Brown will hold in Cleveland, Monday, September 19th, “exploring the consequences of the Wal-Mart business model on American workers, small businesses and communities.”
The battle over Wal-Mart is no stranger to Cleveland. The city challenged Wal-Mart’s entry into a large development site at Steelyard Commons in 2005. To help protect local grocers and workers, Cleveland’s City Council proposed an ordinance that would have limited the sale of groceries in big-box stores, thus preventing Wal-Mart from opening a traditional Supercenter at Steelyard Commons. On the day before the City Council was scheduled to vote, Wal-Mart circulated a letter to council members effectively pulling out of the development. The company cited internal evaluations and specifically said the ordinance was of no consideration. Without the threat of a Supercenter, the ordinance was dropped from consideration. But just two and a half months later, Wal-Mart circumvented the City Council and filed the building permits for a Supercenter at Steelyard Commons.
The Steelyard Commons site fight is highlighted in Wal-Mart Watch’s recent report, ”Shameless: How Wal-Mart Bullies Its Way Into Communities Across America.”
Posted by Media Team on Friday, September 16, 2005
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COMMENTS
I love the latest batch of walmart watch topics.
Rocks Walmart-To help local grocers and merchants, Clevelands city council proposed a big box store ordinance. Whatever happened to free and open competition? Walmart worked their way around it. Bad Walmart. Come on guys, what did you expect them to do, just lay down? The citizens of Cleveland will vote with their pocket book. Want to take any bets on Walmart’s success?
The Ugly Truth-walmart watch is criticizing Walmart’s ability to draw customers because of their “worst designed stores”. Walmart is still number one and walmart watch is losing trying to get them to unionize. Who is winning?
Almost Laughable-That characterizes walmart watch’s efforts pretty well. Walmart is number one. Walmart watch is still trying to get on the top one million list.
Open Letter-Walmart watch continues to try to find something bad in the Walmart Katrina effort. The silly season is still here.
Dirty Tricks-"Walmart stores are often noted for their dirtiness…..” You guys have got to be kidding. Anybody who regularly shops at Walmarts knows this is not true. You might convince the advocates of walmart watch, but they don’t and won’t shop at Walmart anyway. Unless, of course, they wander in to go to the bathroom and decide “hey this isn’t so bad after all.” They will probably become closet Walmart shoppers.
David in Zack AR
Friday, September 16 at 06:51 PM
Who did the circumventing first. It sounds like the city council was adopting another ordinance as a payoff for the liberal money in that city and wal-mart decided to fight back. Wal-mart has to do whatever it can to fight these stupid politicians that adopt these ordinances to protect their union stores.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Friday, September 16 at 09:42 PM
Well doesn’t it seem that a lot of places really don’t want them anymore? You could ask yourself why? Is it just a few malcontents staging all this or is there something else? Your best off Dave and Steve not just looking for the simplest reasons---maybe put a little bit more thought into the mindset of those you feel opposed to.
For one thing it’s not just about WM---at least to me. WM gets the most heat simply because they are ahead of the targets and the sears and the whoevers. The cheapest price shopping experience comes with consequences and these consequences effect everyone including WM’s own employees.
Anyway I’m glad to see Sherrod Brown take an interest in this. To me he’s one of the better members of congress (and I have some republicans that I would include in my list).
larry in elmira, ny
Saturday, September 17 at 01:32 AM
Larry brings up a good point though.
If I can’t shop at Wal-Mart, which discount stores CAN I shop at?
Is Target ok?
Sears/K-Mart?
JC-Penny?
Where exactly am I allowed to shop?
I need groceries this morning. I was going to go to the little farmer’s market downtown. But...those little “mom n’ pop” vendors aren’t unionized. Is it ok for me to buy an apple?
You guys offer a whole bunch of criticism, without offering any alternatives.
Larry in Ithaca, NY
Saturday, September 17 at 09:01 AM
Larry,
If you look, most of the places wal-mart is kept is are the larger cities where the liberals control. Look at New York city. A nonpartisan poll was taken and said that the majority(ove 60%) wanted wal-mart, but the liberals kept it out. No matter, the poll said that the most of the people wanting it would travel out of the city to the surrounding areas to buy at another wal-mart. Wal-mart still gets the sale, but the tax dollars goes somewhere else, hurting NY city.
It doesn’t really matter thou, if you look at the real numbers wal-mart is still getting a large majority of the locations that they want. Just this month alone, the distribution center I work at had 3 grand openings. You multiply that by the 26-27 dc’s across the country and thats 70 new stores. I don’t think the actual was quite that high, but you get the picture.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Saturday, September 17 at 09:06 AM
Also, all of this feeling sorry for the wal-mart employees is a bunch of BS also. If they felt sorry for the employees, the unions wouldn’t spead all the propoganda which causes wal-mart stock to go down, hurting the employees. A large majority of the employees(including myself) suffer everytime wal-mart stock drops. I wouldn’t blame all the dropping of the stock on the ufcw, gas prices have a big factor in it also. The only reason the ufcw feels sorry is that they can’t tap into those 1.3 million and growing employees paychecks for their monthly dues.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Saturday, September 17 at 09:12 AM
What exactly is propaganda to you Steve? Is it just something that you don’t agree with? This is not the black and white world that many of the people here see it as---as for instance it’s the liberals on the one side the right wingers on the other. It’s like we’re supposed to line up and be counted on one side or the other and frankly the Franken’s and the Limbaugh’s make me want to puke. After their diatribes is it our duty to be outraged by whatever it is they were yakking about. That’s propaganda.
As far as the stock market goes and whether WM is up or down or any other company is up or down that goes with the territory. Playing the stock market whether it’s tied to your pension or not is gambling--plain and simple-- and when you gamble you risk. That they’ve left you no other option within house is a problem. Maybe WM should come up with something better.
larry in elmira, ny
Saturday, September 17 at 12:14 PM
Larry,
We’ve covered this ground before, haven’t we? You have a government retirement plan. You don’t have to turn a profit. You have government benefits. You have a good salary and a no layoff policy. Private sector employees don’t have a taxpayer financed life. Employees are no obligated to have a 401k or a pension in the private sector but Wal-Mart provides one. And their stock would be a good investment if the UFCW and the small business people in Bumf**k USA didn’t waste so much money trying to fight them. Steve referred to propaganda-he was correct. The UFCW is telling stories with half-truths at best and outright lies at worst. How about this for something mind blowing: put all the facts out and let the people decide. Apparently someone thinks Wal-Mart is doing a good job. They get 12 applicants for every job opening. They are opening new stores left and right and they will top $300 billion in sales this year, despite the hurricane, gas prices and union lies. Liberals and their small town mom and pops who have had everything their own way for decades are the only people who oppose Wal-Mart, the liberals because they are closet Communists and the mom and pops because they don’t want competition.
Larry, it is not gambling to put your money in the market. Assume you were 25 years old 30 years ago and were earning the medium US wage. If you relied in Social Security as opposed to investing in the market, you would get back about 1/6 of the amount of money the market would have earned you. And the market money is yours, to do with as you wish, to pass on. It is not given by Congress and it is not dependent on a transfer system/Ponzi scheme that is NOT GUARANTEED AND CAN BE CUT OR ELIMINATED BY CONGRESS AT ANY TIME. Historically, the market has averaged a 6% MINIMUM annual return, something Social Security can never hope to match. And money invested creates wealth. The government taking nearly 13% of your wages creates nothing except working people with 13% less in their paychecks. Again, as a government employee, you would be opposed to privitization. The Democrats fear privitization of wealth because then they can’t take it to waste as they wish.
I have two final thoughts:
1. We should NEVER have to pay to rebulld the Gulf Coast and especially New Orelans. When Chicago, a much larger and more important city, was completely destroyed by fire, the taxpayers paid not one dime to rebuild. It all came from private investment and charity. And the homeless, displaced and unemployed? They were advised to obtain high paying employment rebuilding the city or move on. Their were enough jobs for everyone who wanted one. And Chicago rose from the ashes, with the taxpayers not a dollar poorer.
2. How is the emergency $62 billion appropriation going to run out before the end of October when they haven’t even started rebuilding? Doesn’t anyone ask where that money is going? Try spending $62,000 in the private sector and blowing it all on nothing? You will be fired on the spot. I think it’s about time we started holding the crooks (politicians) accountable. They are crooks, else why would they go into politics in the first place?
“The tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of Patriots” - Thomas Jefferson
Nick in Wheeling
Saturday, September 17 at 06:17 PM
Oh yes it is gambling Nick---because just like betting on a horse or going to a casino you stand to make money or you stand to lose it. Investing is gambling. There are no guarantees. You also know that WM provides the least amount of benefits to their employees as they can and that they have no inclination to improve because it will take away from their sacrosanct bottom line. And where do you get these 12 applicants for every WM job? And why would you think that that is something for us to be impressed by even if it were true? It would tell me then that things are even worse than I had imagined---with such a big scramble over what amounts to a low wage job. You know that yourself. You
can pontificate about them being good jobs all you want--the fact of the matter is they’re not and their going to get worse if only because of the rise in gas prices--which this winter will mean a rise in heating bills--and eventually prices rising even at WM (if only to pay for the cost of transportation).
Whether we pay for rebuilding New Orleans or not what makes Chicago more important? As for govt. spending look to the party that calls themselves ‘conservatives’--they have the presidency and they control both houses. Apparently they don’t control acts of ‘God’ or Mother nature (as I would have it) or I’m sure they would have stopped Katrina.
On Mr. Jefferson--great american that he was--he was also an unrepentant slaveholder. In your quotation he’s talking about somebody else and his or her blood--not his own.
larry in elmira, ny
Saturday, September 17 at 07:36 PM
Larry larry larry,,,
once again you believe what the UFCW tells you.
First, when they opened the wal-mart dc here in my town, they had quite a few thousand applicants for 300-400 jobs. Now we have over 600 jobs with the chance off adding another 100+ in the next year, and we still get hundreds of applications a month.
Benefit wise, I came from a factory where our benefits were nothing like I have at wal-mart. I have the choice between 3 type of health insurance, from walmarts health insurance to 2 different hmos. Wal-marts health insurance is a steal also. Yea, you may pay 10 dollars more a visit, but it covers everything and has no lifetime limits on serious health issues. My brothers, fighting luekemia, found out that his union health insurance only had a $200,000 limit. They offered him different insurance that had no lifetime limits, but it was 1000/month for a single person. If he would have had wal-mart insurance, he would have paid 40/pay period and had unlimited insurance.
Other benefits I have include, eye insurance,std and ltd insurance, profit sharing, a 401k, 3 weeks vacation, i have built up 192 hours of sick time(after 192 hours, it converts hour for hour to personnal time), over a 100 hours of personnal time,and this is just a few of the benefits. With our distribution center, we receive quarterly bonuses because we operate at such a high level of safety and productivity, and 4 out of the last 5 years we were the best distribution center in grocery with wal-mart. Our may job in the warehouse, being a orderfiller job pays the most in the building nonmanagement wise, and they have the opportunity to earn 30% bonus on their weekly paycheck measured by their performance and accuracy.I would say that over 90% of our orderfillers receive anywhere from 1-30% bonus each week.With wal-mart being one of the best companies when it comes to distribution and warehousing, that puts us near the top in the world, which we are all proud of it.If this was a union operated warehouse, we would have nowhere near the productivity that we have. We would more people for each job then we needed, and everyone would receive the bonus, no matter how productive you were.
Also, another diffence would be we would never be able to get rid of unproductive people, noone would ever get fired. Yes, people get fired at wal-mart, but it takes quite abit of effort to. You go through a series of coachings and steps till you can get fired. If you punch in late, that equals one coaching, no matter what the excuse. If you call off, 1 coaching no matter the excuse. It takes 3 coachings to reach a step and 3 steps till you get a day of decision. Here is when they take you aside and discuss the situation with you and tell you to get your head on straight if you want to keep this job. If you keep you record clean for 6 months, a step is removed. After a year, another step is removed. I know, to some union worker, this would seem unfair, but if you want to run a productive company of over a million associates, you have to set a firm but fair policy. I have been with wal-mart for over 7 years, and the most i have ever had was 1 coaching at any one time on my record. Also, management cannot write you up with notifying you, so you are well aware of your situation way before you get in a bad situation.
With my job in the distribution center, I am given the responsibilty of millions of dollars of sales each and every week and given the power to make big decisions if the need arises. I am not management, but given alot of reponsibilty I never had at my last job. That’s why wal-mart has become the company they have become, they empower people to make decisions when needed without delay. That is why they are receiving so much praise for their katrina relief, some store managers were on the ball and started everything rolling quicker then the goverment or anyone else.
Once again, I am thankful for my job, and look forward to having it a long time....
p.s. Nick, good reply above on the private sector....
steve in Bedford,Pa
Saturday, September 17 at 10:17 PM
I am just wondering, what is the unions going to say when Wal-mart perfects their neighborhood markets and start rolling them out nation wide. They wouldn’ t be able to get their liberal friends to pass big-box laws to keep the markets out, since they are alot smaller then a supercenter and wouldn’t be affected by the law. They place these stores between supercenter stores and carry a smaller assortment then you would find at a supercenter. They could also put these in the major cities and not have to worry about space issues. Once they get this rolling out in the next few years, this could really put a damper on the UFCW...Brighter days are coming.....
Also, thanks nick for defending some of my comments that larry takes exception to. I get tired of trying to speak common sense to him, so sometimes I just don’t respond.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Saturday, September 17 at 10:31 PM
Hrrumph!.
I am still here.
Hope you are - someday I’ll post.
I’m holding my breath ..
And wishing Walmart did the same after donations.
Wondering why they didn’t ...
And spent more on pr, which wasn’t spent on employees.
Tit for tat.
Anonymous1 in
Sunday, September 18 at 02:09 AM
Steve--whatever your job is with this distribution center it doesn’t seem to equate with the normal run of the mill employee working in the actual WM store job. You might just be looking at the situation from your own particular vantage point---at least it seems to me. It’s already been discussed over and over again how the majority of WM’s employees if not falling on the wrong side of the federal poverty level guideline of statistics set by the Census Bureau through the office of Homeland Security they are not far away. I would think that most of them are not getting those 3 weeks vacation you are nor all of the same consideration when it
comes to being fired or not---at least to listen to some coming on here occasionally recounting how after the first time they did this or the second time they did that yadda yadda yadda. Your probably making more than them too which is good---somebody should make something for your company. Even so generally speaking for the grand majority of your company’s employees the pay and the benefits aren’t very good. This is where the argument against WM (at least in one direction) springs from. Give your average employee a raise to $12. Forget the UFCW altogether then. All those in need of insurance will then really be able to make the decision of whether they want it or not--won’t they?
With gas going up--eventually other things follow--heating, rent, prices altogether--keeping them at the same wages---well they are going to be feeling the pinch even more now
wouldn’t you think?
I don’t know--maybe it’s just me but I don’t see much difference between the republican (so called conservatives) and the democrats (so called liberals). They’re pretty much after the same thing--power and pretty much don’t care how they get it. You could just as easily call one WM and the other Target. As Nick I would expect would agree this administration as McCain so blithely put it ‘spends money like a drunken sailor’. Not much conservative then to my definition.
Better than the Clintion administration? No. IMO they’re just as bad.
larry in elmira, ny
Sunday, September 18 at 07:34 AM
Larry,
a good percentage of the jobs in the stores are taken by people looking for a second job, retired people looking for a little extra money, or high school kids looking for their first job. You can’t really consider them making below the poverty line,when they are not using this job as a main source of living. The ones who are using the job as a major source of employment have more then ample opportunity to advance, they just have to work hard. Anyone from our local store had the opportunity to come work at our distribution center when it opened, and still have the chance when we have any openings. You can’t blame it on wal-mart that they don’t want to take advantage of the situation.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Sunday, September 18 at 11:07 PM
Well that’s a point I can grant you Steve. I have a brother who would fall in the category you describe working part time for Home Depot because his other job no longer pays as much as it used to. When we look at statistics for jobs and unemployment figures there’s another kind of dynamic at work and hopefully it speaks to those in High Schools around the country that their education is important and that they need to further it as much as possible because there are jobs and there are jobs and some are much better than others.
larry in elmira, ny
Monday, September 19 at 09:36 AM
Typical Brown. Elitist, condescending. Let us ignore the facts that Cleveland needs jobs, that Wal-Mart provides jobs, that Wal-Mart increases the standard of living of everyone by providing commodities at lower prices. Let us also ignore that the workers overseas (OK, China) providing goods for Wal-Mart are earning more than their counterparts working for the state or other companies. Let us ignore that fact that people working for Wal-Mart are making above minimum wage to start, getting increases, and are being offered insurance. Oh, yeah, when you ignore the facts, you can begin to agree with Brown.
Matt in Cleveland, OH
Monday, September 19 at 10:38 AM
Larry,
I have to give you credit, your one of the more enjoyable responders that I actually don’t mind responding back to. Even though I don’t agree with your point of view, that’s what is great about this country, that we are free to think and say what we like.
One of these differences of thought that I never responded to was your idea that investing in the market is gambling where social security is all good..One example where I think social security is a joke is my brother. He worked for a company for 10 years, where he paid his social security taxes, plus invested a little in his companies 401k. A year and a half ago, he was diagnosed with luekemia and had to take a indefinite leave of abstence from work for treatment. He immediately filed his paper work for social security benefits which pay out some when this situation occurs, even though it takes 6 months for the paper work to be processed and the first check to arrive. One year ago, he passed away from the disease, one week after getting his first check. Since he passed away, all the rest of the money he paid into his social security got turned back over to the government. Fortunately, the money he had invested had done decent to help paid some of his medical bills that had built up. If he would have had the choice to invest in the market instead of paying for the social security(which basically did no good at all), he would have had alot more money built up to pay his health bills, even if the stock market would have lost him money. Losing a little of his money in stock beats losing it all in social security anyday.
steve in Bedford,Pa
Monday, September 19 at 12:30 PM
Steve,
I’m sorry to hear about your brother. In a way, he was a victim of big government. If he had been able to take that 13% of his wages that the government stole, and invest it in the market, he would have had a nice sum, which he could have used as he wished and then passed on the remainder to his family. Larry says that the stock market is gambling. He is wrong. The market has NEVER failed to average at least a 6% annual return in any 10 year period. Over the last 30 years, annual returns have more than averaged out to 6%. Now, start working at 25. Invest 13% of your wages in the market at 6% compounded and work 40 years. Compare that with someone relying strictly on Social Security, assuming its still around. Using the median annual wage, the investor would have somewhere in the neighborhood of $1.06 million in a PERSONAL account that would belong to him. The Social Security person, assuming the program was in existence, no requirements or benefit structures had changed and he lives the normal life expectency will get about $186,000. That is in monthly payments not lump sum. If he dies before his life expectency, he loses money and he can’t pass it on. Putting the numbers side by side, the market is much safer. It is safer because it is governed by reason and the profit motive, not liberalism and socialist Ponzi schemes. That 13% of your wage is YOUR money not the governments. If we want to make sure everyone saves for retirement, force that 13% into the market. Don’t allow people to play games with the money and don’t allow the brokers to churn and burn their accounts. Can you imagine the effect such money would have on our economy? Even the surplus (the amount we are overpaying for Social Security in a given year) amounts to more than $70 billion. Imagine that much cash coming into the market. We’re talking job creation and wealth creation on an unprecedented scale. Of course, morons feel the government is more trustworthy and are content to earn negative returns at the mercy of politicians.
Biggest Misconceptions About Social Security:
1. There is a Social Security Trust Fund. FALSE. Every surplus dime collected is used to pay general budget items. The money is replaced by IOU’s, to be paid for by future taxpayers. Current estimates place this liability at anywhere from $6 trillion to $24 trillion.
2. Your Social Security money is invested for you. FALSE. Every dime you pay in gets transferred right back out to current payees. It is a Ponzi scheme under the guise of a government safety net.
3. Social Security is guaranteed. FALSE. Government could, tomorrow, reduce or eliminate benefits altogether, increase payroll or other taxes or take money from other programs to pay for Social Security. There is no guarantee that it will be here tomorrow-unless you trust politicians.
4. Seniors would live in poverty without Social Security. MAYBE TRUE IN SOME CASES. But Seniors are the wealthiest demographic in America. The average senior in the US spends more on gambling than they do on food, clothing, housing or prescription drugs. If you think Seniors should not have to choose between dinner and playing the slot machines, throw yourself off the nearest bridge. You will be doing the world a favor.
Did I ramble? I hope I made my point.
Nick in Wheeling
Monday, September 19 at 12:52 PM
Nick,
I know your type. I’m a Democratic committeeman who works the polls every year, and I’m always seeing working-class/middle-class traitors like you. Guys who just got off the second shift at the local non-union factory or just out of the sales office for the day. Or the independent contractors/consultants, working 80 hours a week for $30K a year without benefits. You try to hand them a Democratic sample ballot and they scoff at you. Either something about gun grabbers or supporting welfare queens. I shake my head and feel sorry for them. Do they really believe the corporate tycoons are on their side??? Like you Nick, they’re blind to their own reality. You’re from Wheeling, WV - a town that was built by steel and died when southern mini-mills and China started dumping her steel and costing jobs. But I guess you would consider that progress. Destroyed families and communities sacrificed in the name of capitalism. For god’s wake up and look around your community. But as long as it’s not happening to you, everything is okay. Talk about selfishness. Perhaps even more appalling is you’re probably one generation removed from being a steelworker’s son! Let’s see, you live and probably work in Wheeling. No major corporations locaated there, so you’re probably a small businessman or middle-management guy in some small firm. And let me guess, hard work will keep you insulated from the Wal-Mart-ing of our economy??? You’re dreaming Nick. The capitalists don’t give about me or you.
Jeb in Pittsburgh, PA
Monday, September 19 at 03:41 PM
Well, either that, or it’s Wheeling, IL, and he’s a very comfortable steelworker’s son.
Della Schwartz in Skokie, IL
Monday, September 19 at 04:04 PM
The problem with a society that marginalizes its common citizens for the benefit of corporate interests is that so many of its citizens will then become more and more obsessed with their own well being and more and more unconcerned with other beings around them (excluding maybe or maybe not immeditae family). So the people of this country are not focused on the common good nor do they seem to have any particular direction in mind to make our society greater.
Ideas such as LBJ’s War on Poverty which had taken root in the 60’s are laughable these days and not replaced by anything. It can be dismissed out of hand and off the subject simply by referring to Johnson’s very sordid past and a record of deciet in Viet Nam. Still there’s no real direction for the people of this country---it’s just get ahead whatever way you can--every man or woman for him or herself. This to me is Nick’s problem (although I doubt that he sees it as a problem at all). I have hope for him though that some day he might see things at least a little differently. None of us are right or wrong all the time and even when we are right--there’s usually some ignorance involved with our point of view. Something we’ve left out or haven’t considered properly. Those who believe in absolutes end up as fanatics.
larry in elmira, ny
Monday, September 19 at 04:32 PM
Nick
it looks like we got another mixed up fool in jeb. Just because some one from the working/middle class doesn’t want the goverment to support them, and actually wants to work hard and earn a fair living doesn’t make them a traitor. Talk like that is why the democrats lost so many of the last elections. Keep thinking like that, and you will continue to keep losing by turning the middle class against you. The middle class is the main block when it comes to voting, so keep spreading the hate jeb. The republican party really appreciates the fine work your doing....
steve in Bedford,Pa
Monday, September 19 at 05:07 PM
Steve,
Thanks. It seems that whenever someone has a problem with a legitimate argument on here, they attack the person, not the argument. At least Larry has common sense and he makes some good points. The rest? Oh well. I guess I am a “traitor” because I tend to lean conservative. I vote Republican if the Republican has earned my vote. Otherwise, I vote Libertarian, which is where I’m registered. By the way, Jeb, I am not from Wheeling, I do not work 80 hour weeks and a company does not have to be a well-known Fortune 500 company to be successful and line pockets. Trust me on this one. My idea of a traitor is someone who betrays this country to a foreign power in a way that leaves us vulnerable to a military/intelligence/terrorist strike. Period. I figure Jeb is angry because there is just no work for him these days. People are more intelligent and independent and see no need to join a union. With the advent of the internet, blogs and more conservative media options, people can now think for themselves. Liberals hate this. There is a reason why the # 1 cable news channel is Fox, why the #1 blog is Drudge, why the # 1 talk radio show is Rush Limbaugh and why the fastest growing newspaper in America is the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review. People were force fed liberal talk for years. Now that they have CHOICE, where do they go? Jeb, in this area, some of the best jobs are at Ormet and PPG. Both companies’ unions are out on strike, Ormet since last November. What are they hoping to accomplish? People complain about the scarcity of good high paying labor jobs and these guys walk out on their employer? Great idea, guys. Look at the Ormet workers. They cost themselves their jobs and livelihoods. For what? Wheeling-Pitt’s workers were out for 14 months a few years back. They went back to work on roughly the same terms they left. They gained nothing. My father lost his job when I was a young child. All I knew was the union didn’t save my father’s job and didn’t keep us from going hungry at times. But I went to college and tried to better myself. I want to earn as much money as I can and I feel that only a libertarian free market will allow me, and others, the opportunity to do so. People who pass laws to regulate and tie down economic success are people who cannot compete in a free market.
By the way, Jeb, you mentioned Chinese steel “dumping”. What about US Steel? It makes steel overseas for a third of its’ US cost and ships it here to sell at market prices, essentially earning a 300% margain over US manufactured sales. Is that “dumping”? Jeb, do you know why Nucor is the largest and most successful steel company in America and why its’ workers are the best compensated? There are many reasons but the greatest is that they are non-union. Think about that while your playing golf today.
Nick in Wheeling
Tuesday, September 20 at 09:00 AM
Like I said Nick, it’s about you - neighbors be damned! Unfortunately Nick you may never change your ways, but your beloved GOP better. In the wake of Hurricane Katrina, the “ownership society"/radical individualistic philosophy isn’t gonna float in 2006. People in the Gulf are hurting and they need a collective response from society. That’s mean keeping the estate state and using those funds to help in the recovery effort. That position has already been echoed by GOP Senator Chuck Grassley.
Jeb in Pittsburgh, PA
Tuesday, September 20 at 05:00 PM
Jeb
This idea of “collectivism” is being taught in schools now and it has polluted our society. We do have a moral obligation, as individuals, to help those less fortunate. We do not have a moral obligation to hand over 50% of our earnings at gunpoint because there is a class of low lifes who feel that they should not be required to work. Whatever happened to work ethic? Did anyone read my statment about the Chicago fire and how the city was rebuilt by displaced citizens using 100% private funds? Why should I contribute to what amounts to more than 12% of our federal budget being sent to rebuild a city below sea level, surronded by a huge lake and the Gulf Of Mexico? Find me one insurance company that would agree to insure the property there now. Why should taxpayers pay for something that the private sector would never pay for? Individualism is the strength of this country. Did the first settlers have government programs to help them? Did western Pioneers get government handouts? Did early Farmers get a check to not farm? NO! People used to be individuals, not a bunch of robots. Let me tell you about America. The great majority, I would venture to say more than 60%, would agree with me on the following issues:
1. America is a society founded on Judeo-Christian beliefs. Morality plays a strong role in society.
2. Education is the responsibility of the parent or, through voluntary pooling of resources, the local town.
3. A strong national defense is essential. Money wasted on defense is inexcusable.
4. Financial solvency can only be achieved through spending cuts, tax cuts and the increased business activity produced by the PRIVATE sector.
5. Government produces nothing; it is a financial drain on our economy.
6. Criminals should be punished harshly. Our police have their hands tied and our court system goes easier on child molestors than it does on someone caught smoking a joint. This needs to change. Swift, public executions for the worst crimes, hard labor camps in Alaska for less heinous crimes.
7. Charity is the responsibility of the individual or private groups, not government.
8. Handouts should encourage self-sufficiency not a lifetime of sloth and crime.
9. Your Constitutional Rights are absolute until they interfere with the Constitutional Rights of another, ie. you have freedom of speech until you limit another persons’ free speech.
10. America is the greatest nation on Earth. No other country in the history of the world has enjoyed our combination of peace, prosperity, health, happiness, freedom and safety. We are great, we are not criminals and we are not inferior. If America is so horrible why are their millions of illegals literally dying to come here?
I could go on and on but I stated my basic beliefs and I think the majority of Americans share my beliefs but maybe they don’t want to be seen as rude or unpopular or non-conforming or maybe they just feel they can’t make a difference. They are wrong. Go to the polls and vote in conservative Libertarians. We can change America for the better.
Nick in Wheeling
Wednesday, September 21 at 11:30 AM
Nick,
You’re right - you are overtaxed, as am I. That’s because billionaries like the Walton Family are undertaxed, and they’re fighting like hell to keep it that way in their efforts to repeal the estate tax.
Jeb in Pittsburgh, PA
Wednesday, September 21 at 11:50 AM
Jeb,
Let’s be honest. If the estate tax affected everyone, there would be cries to eliminate it. Class envy keeps it going. Why should the Waltons give the government BILLIONS of dollars when they die? What did the government and the taxpayers do to earn it? The Waltons, and other wealthy citizens, are entitled to the fruits of their labor. You are entitled to leave your children your home and your savings, if that’s what you want. That is your decision. It is not up to the government. And if you think we are overtaxed because of the estate tax, you are mistaken. The tax provides very little in the way of federal revenues. But it hurts families a great deal. You pay taxes all your life, on everything. Why should the government tax your death, too? Here’s a tip for you. The top 1% of taxpayers in this country pay nearly 40% of the income taxes. The top 10% pay nearly 70%. The lowest 30% of taxpayers pay 0. You only need to gross about $100,000/yr to be in the top tax bracket which means the 150 or more UFCW officials on my previous list are in the top 1%. Maybe they contribute something after all!
Nick in Wheeling
Wednesday, September 21 at 02:06 PM
“Such inherited economic power is as inconsistent with the ideals of this generation as inherited political power was inconsistent with the ideals of the generation which established our government.” -FDR
Don’t see a Walton…
http://www.responsiblewealth.org/estatetax/ETCall_Signers.html
Randy in Providence, RI
Wednesday, September 21 at 03:01 PM
Spoken like a true liberal. FDR inherited political power from his family and economic wealth and power from his father. Typical liberal double-talk. Or in FDR’s case, NewSpeak.
Nick in Wheeling
Thursday, September 22 at 10:42 AM
Bill Gates has no problem with the estate tax why should the Waltons?
What about your boy President Bush? Talk about a person who inherited political and economic power. Bush would be working at Taco Bell if it weren’t for his family.
Randy in Providence, RI
Thursday, September 22 at 10:59 AM
No offense to any Taco Bell employees. Think outside the bun my friends.
Randy in Providence, RI
Thursday, September 22 at 11:00 AM
Way to go Walmart! What is all the problem? People are still shopping and seeking low cost items. Just because Walmart thought out of the box, and now compitition is crying, does this make them bad? They are a business guys! You dumb idoits! It is not a self regulating government agency. Look to your government if you don’t like something, Walmart is just the NUMBER 1 store in the country, gee who made it that way? Who are really the grippers?, look a little deeper guys into the media agenda that you all buy into every time you turn on the boob tube or read a paper. Look to your government!
As for the workers, there are laws governing (or at least they look like it), regulating and protecting workers.
What a bunch of assess complaining how America made Walmart the #1 company and then want to point the finger at them for bringing the very low cost items that made them number one in the country!
Randy in California
Sunday, September 25 at 01:49 PM
A correction for Randy. You said “Talk about a person who inherited political” about President Bush.
Bush had to earn every bit of his political power by asking the voters for it. You should take a civics class or something: Presidents cannot appoint their sons as new Presidents. The voters have to make this decision.
There is no reason for the estate tax. The government is just being too greedy. The rich already pay much more than the non-rich. Eliminating the estate tax is one way to take a step forward to establishing the sovereignty of the people over the state.
justice in free world
Sunday, September 25 at 06:27 PM
President Bush’s grandfather was a Senator and his father is a former President and CIA director...you don’t think that opens a few political doors for him? No one said anything about appointing anyone. President Bush was allowed to go to the best schools and even though he failed at several businesses, was bailed out by family members. Most people do not have that luxury.
Randy in Providence, RI
Monday, September 26 at 12:37 PM
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