Wal-Mart Booted Back To Bentonville

To all Wal-Mart Associates:

This thread is a good example of how the union spins things, let’s analyze it, shall we?

“The residents of Helotes, Texas withstood the pressure and beat back Wal-Mart.”

How did anyone win here?  Wal-Mart spent a lot of money on feasibility studies, but won’t end up building here, for now.  And, the citizens of the town will have to drive a distance to shop at the Wal-Mart that will be built in the next town over.

“But symbolic of how Wal-Mart deals with real people, the retailer did not even write its own letter, but used a public relation/advertising firm to write the letter.”

This is on a site that wants you to hire them to write your letters to management instead of doing it yourself.  Kind of hypocritical, I think.

“Schauer made a veiled threat: “Although Wal-Mart is confident that these actions could have been remedied in court, Wal-Mart is unwilling to force the City of Helotes into expensive litigation relative to this site.”

Where’s the threat here?  Definition of THREAT: A declaration of intention to inflict injury or pain. 

It seems that Wal-Mart is backing off, not threatening.  But, I guess you could say that by not building the store there, the people will suffer loss of jobs, tax money and low prices.

“This isn’t the first time Wal-Mart has relied on spinmeisters to do its dirty work. “

What dirty work?  Is writing a letter basically saying “you win”, dirty work?  Who’s being the real spinmeister here?

Robby,

The definition of threat is:

1. An expression of an intention to inflict pain, injury, evil, or punishment.
2. An indication of impending danger or harm.
3. One that is regarded as a possible danger; a menace.

Maybe the full definition will help you figure out what they meant by “veiled threat”.

Robert Springer:  You are so full of crap, I can smell you every time the wind is from the south.

In your last post to this topic thread you stated: “I think.” First of all who cares what you think.  Secondly, you should be the very last person to accuse anyone of “spinning the facts.” Are you still getting your hourly updates from Wal-Mart’s Bentonville headquarters?

You ask the ridiculous question: “How did anyone win here?” You mean to tell us all that if Wal-Mart doesn’t get its way, nobody wins?  Excuse me while I have another good laugh at your expense.

You go on to say: “Wal-Mart spent a lot of money on feasibility studies, but won’t end up building here, for now.” For now---oh so this is yet another example of Wal-Mart not being able to understand the word “NO?” They will most likely come after Helotes, TX again right?  And you say Wal-Mart doesn’t bully communities.  They’re doing the same thing to Jefferson, WI now.  Jefferson has turned down Wal-Mart twice already, but Wal-Mart still doesn’t get the message.

Let’s use your definition of a THREAT:  “A declaration of intention to inflict injury or pain.” If you don’t think that Wal-Mart driving Red Esry and his family out of business after 40 years didn’t cause any injury or pain, what would you call it?

Until you and all the other Wal-Mart apologists here like Lori, Ellis, jc etc. can definitively show me where the Greenwald movie was factually wrong… I’m going to ignore you for the most part.

Tom Boese
Field Producer - Wisconsin
Brave New Films

Tom

Aren’t you changing the subject.  No where in Robert’s post was there a mention of your useless movie.  Why don’t you try addressing Robert’s points?

Who else should write the letter to the citizens?  The contruction workers?  It’s a corporation who divides the workload.  Why is this a problem?

Ron Galloway here. Um, the first 20 minutes of Greenwald’s movie is factually wrong.

The hardware store closed BEFORE WallyMart opened, because the son was not a very good businessman. It has since reopened and is thriving. It had nothing to do with WalMart, or a refinance that would have plunged them even deeper into debt.

DOH!!!!

It’s just a store. People love to shop there. So what?  Worry about something important, like harrassing UCLA into accepting Jim Gilliam for a lung transplant.

Ron Galloway:  I think we can, and we should agree to just disagree when it comes to the whole “H&H;story” in the Greenwald movie.  Since your film proposes to “tell the other side of the story,” I expected you to pile on the Wal-Mart spin wagon regarding H&H;.

I’m so tired of having to post a response to the H&H;critics.  Apparently this is the only issue they have to whine about.  Believe me Ron, if it were anyone else raising the H&H;story, they would be roundly ignored.

So, for Ron’s benefit and anyone else who is still complaining about the “H&H;story,” here it is one more time.

First of all, there was nothing factually wrong with the first 20 minutes in the film.  The H&H;story was just a way to draw viewers into the film.  Nowhere in the movie did antone say that Wal-Mart was the sole reason for the Hunters going out of business.  So please get over it...OK? This is what we are in agreement on:
1) H&H;closed about 3 months BEFORE Wal-Mart opened.  This is TRUE!  Since it takes 10-12 months to build a Supercenter, the residents of Middlefield (including the Hunters) had plenty of warning.  They knew when it was time to get out.
2) Jon Hunter allowed the business to get into trouble.  This is also TRUE!  It was generally felt that H&H;was having problems since 2002.  Jon Hunter allowed his payroll expenses to soar to 30% or more.  Jon Hunter also went through a divorce.  Life happens.
3) The store is open again under new management. This is also TRUE!  The new owner also owns the Ace franchise in Chardon, Ohio which is 15 miles away.  When he was only in Chardon, the new owner Jay Negin, was one of the loudest critics of Wal-Mart.  Now it seems like he wants to draw as little attention as possible to himself, quietly fly under the radar, and “compete” with Wal-Mart.
4) Jon Hunter was denied a business loan.  FACT!  One of the reasons the bank gave to him was that his building was not worth as much since Wal-Mart was coming to town. FACT! (per my conversation with Jon Hunter)

These some facts the movie didn’t mention:
1) There are 3 smaller grocery stores in Middlefield: A Sparkle grocery store, Eagle Foods, and a Sav-a-Lot.  None of these 3 stores are doing as well as they were before Wal-Mart arrived.  In one store’s case, business is down 25%.
2) The developer who owned the land where Wal-Mart built, also owns 5 smaller pieces of property surrounding the Wal-Mart store.  He has been unable to attract buyers for these lots and has recently taken at least some of them off the market.  Could it be that nobody wants to build next to a Supercenter? (Well--OK, maybe Taco Bell and McDonalds)
3) One other businessman in Middlefield recently took his property off the market because it wasn’t selling since Wal-Mart opened.
4) According to the Village Administrator, Dan Weir, the Wal-Mart Supercenter is not “hitting the numbers” like they had hoped.  Many of the Amish in the community are not supporting Wal-Mart.  This isn’t stopping Wal-Mart from building 2 more Supercenters in the area, one opening early 2006 in Madison, and one opening in nearby Chardon.  But of course...Wal-Mart just wants to go where it’s wanted...Right?

Lastly, the Hunters opened their store in 1962.  That was a banner year for the discount industry.  That same year the following retailers opened stores: S.S. Kresge opened their first K-Mart in Garden City, Michigan, F.W. Woolworth started its Woolco chain, Dayton Hudson opened its first Target Store, and some independent in Rogers, Arkansas opened something called a Wal-Mart. (source- Sam Walton’s Autobiography, Made in America, p. 49)

Tom Boese
Field Producer - Wisconsin
Brave New Films

No one cares about your movie.

Tom.  Do you honestly expect us to believe that you did not want the viewers of the movie to believe that Walmart caused H & H Hardware to close?  Your movie was not inaccurate, just intellectually dishonest.  So what other little tidbits in the movie were not inaccurate, but just merely misleading?

Ronny again,

Darn Tom, I didn’t mean for you to have to type a dissertation. Good points, though.

You have all been nothing but gentlemen to me, BTW.

But can we get the freaking UFCW, who has a massive health plan, to put some pressure to bear on UCLA on Gilliam’s behalf?

You guys put out for them, now tell them to return the favor.

In Greenwald’s defense, he IS covering Gilliam’s health insurance.

Ron Galloway

Tom,

Also, that’s the last I’ll ever bring up H&H;. If you notice, I stayed away from it in almost all my media interviews. I’m just cranky and tired. This whole thing got a little bigger than I planned.

Having said that, Gilliam’s mom’s blog is heartbreaking. Get the union to call UCLA’s board or Arnold. It’s just F***ing criminal the way he is being jacked around. My wife is a cancer doctor, and she is aghast at UCLA’s behavior. We’ve been following it since September.

Checking out.

Ron Galloway

Tom Boese wrote:

“ You ask the ridiculous question: “How did anyone win here?” You mean to tell us all that if Wal-Mart doesn’t get its way, nobody wins? “

First, what did the town win?  They are exactly the way they were.  What did Wal-Mart win?  They are exactly the way they were, except out some money.  And, what about the citizens of Helotes, Texas, do you mean to suggest that there are no citizens that would have wanted this store?  I would bet that if a poll were taken there, a large amount of the citizens wanted the store.  But, now they won’t get it.  They lose.

“ You go on to say: “Wal-Mart spent a lot of money on feasibility studies, but won’t end up building here, for now.” For now---oh so this is yet another example of Wal-Mart not being able to understand the word “NO?” “

What I meant by “for now”, is that someday in the future it might be that those citizens realize their mistake, they will be begging for Wal-Mart to return.  It’s not a matter of not understanding the word “NO”, it is a matter of a small group of people making decisions for the many.

‘ If you don’t think that Wal-Mart driving Red Esry and his family out of business after 40 years didn’t cause any injury or pain, what would you call it? “

Who is Red Esry and what does Wal-Mart not building a store have to do with him?

“ Until you and all the other Wal-Mart apologists here like Lori, Ellis, jc etc. can definitively show me where the Greenwald movie was factually wrong… I’m going to ignore you for the most part. “

We didn’t see the movie, remember and we are not going to waste our money buying it.  So, you won’t get your cut, understand, bet you thought this movie was going to be some kind of blockbuster didn’t you?  Sorry, busted.  This has nothing to do with your movie, it has to do with Wal-Mart backing off in Helotes, Texas.  Quit trying to plug your movie and get with the program here.

Something to think about

As in many locations around the country, people that live in towns that keep walmart out, drive to other locations to shop at walmart, i know people that do that very thing.

Why not have those jobs in your town and save all that gas and travel time, just a thought.

merry christmas

The site admin need to make you registar for an account to participate in these blogs ( i know a blog is open and anoymous) but buy doing this when the walmart spin wagon rolls in they can simply bring it to a screaching halt buy banning that user.

just a suggestion

refer to beging of comments

To all wal-mart associates.

Brandon in Myrtle Beach.... guess your not open to debate?  Call it the Wal-Mart spin wagon or whatever you want to call it, but don’t you find it interesting that for everything the union(s) throw out Wal-Mart has proof to prove it’s wrong?  Talk about Wal-Mart as much as you want, but at least tell all the sides of the story.

Brandon wrote:

“ refer to beging of comments

To all wal-mart associates. “

In case you didn’t know, this website was created by the union for the purpose of getting Wal-Mart ‘associates’ to join the union.  So, addressing the ‘Associates’, is a natural thing as this site is addressed to them.

November 08, 2005
CONTACT:
Kim Freeman
202-822-2127 x 111
kfreeman@americanrightsatwork.org



WAL-MART, DRAGGING DOWN U.S. LABOR STANDARDS

WASHINGTON, DC—A new report released today by American Rights at Work unveils how Wal-Mart routinely violates the rights of its employees.  Revelations are continually surfacing about Wal-Mart’s mistreatment of its employees, including accusations of gender discrimination, substandard health benefits, and the denial of lunch breaks, “But most Americans don’t know about how Wal-Mart’s unionbusting activity prevents workers from forming unions to address this mistreatment,” says American Rights at Work Board Chair David Bonior.

“WAL-MART: Rolling Back Workers’ Wages, Rights, and the American Dream,” offers a comprehensive examination of the company’s abysmal labor standards, including its poor compensation, difficult working conditions, and effective strategy to remain union-free.

The report reveals that Wal-Mart has prevented its 1.3 million-member workforce from forming a union by using both legal and illegal means.  The company’s wide-ranging union-avoidance tactics include profiling individual employees at stores that are likely to support unions, and using an anti-union hotline for managers to call at the first sign of employee discontent.  As a result of its behavior, nearly 300 unfair labor charges were filed against Wal-Mart, resulting in almost 100 federal complaints against the company from 1998-2003.

“Wal-Mart’s willingness to break labor law sends the wrong message to America’s workers and employers,” says American Rights at Work Executive Director Mary Beth Maxwell.  “When the world’s largest employer dominates the market by slashing wages and benefits and violating workers’ rights, it legitimates and accelerates similar behavior among its vendors and rivals,” asserts Maxwell.

The study also explores how Wal-Mart is wreaking havoc on labor standards for U.S. workers beyond its own.  According to data released by University of California at Berkeley for the report, Wal-Mart’s presence in the retail industry is likely reducing the total earnings of American retail workers by $4.7 billion annually.

“As the debate on the social ramifications of Wal-Martization continues, the practice of unionbusting must be included in the conversation,” says Bonior.  “Unless we examine unionbusting at Wal-Mart and the current labor law system that tolerates its practice, we resign ourselves to do more with less—less job security, less time, less health care, and less hope.”

WAL-MART: Rolling Back Workers’ Wages, Rights, and the American Dream is available for download at www.americanrightsatwork.org.

Robert Springer:  Again, your uninformed mind betrays you.  You and your Pro Wal-Mart cronies sure like to cite those polls don’t you?  You stated: “I would bet that if a poll were taken there, a large amount of the citizens wanted the store.  But, now they won’t get it.  They lose.” Well, a poll wasn’t taken...in fact I think they call them referendums.  Wal-Mart doesn’t like community referendums because they know that most of the time they will get their discounted ass kicked.  Again, I’ll use a local example of Stoughton, Wisconsin.  In Stoughton, Wal-Mart doesn’t want a referendum...because THEY’LL LOSE!  Instead, they would rather manipulate the 12 city alders and stack the deck in their favor.  The city has refused to hold an open hearing where citizens can ask questions of their leaders.  The average citizen in Stoughton has been shut out of the planning process.  So no more crap from you about “ a small group of people making decisions for the many.”

This is Wal-Mart’s modus operandi.  I could give you hundreds of examples across this country, where Wal-Mart prefers to intimidate part-time mayors and city leaders, rather than putting it to a vote by the citizens in the community.

As far as your pathetic question: “Who is Red Esry and what does Wal-Mart not building a store have to do with him?” You answered this yourself when you said: “ We didn’t see the movie, remember and we are not going to waste our money buying it.”

So why should I or anyone else here give any credence to your constant babbling?  Unlike Ron Galloway, you are incapable of addressing my question on an intellectual level, even if you disagree with the points in the film.

Tom Boese
Brave New Films

Can anyone tell me when it comes to labor “facts”, the anti-walmart crowd most times spout out the crap produced by the"University of California at Berkeley. Everyone knows most colleges are ran by the liberals, so why would you expect anything else coming from Berkeley.

Tom, if your so up for letting the public decide on whether or not they should have a walmart, why couldn’t NY let walmart build in the city when polls were overwhelming in favor of Walmart. But no, the liberal city council said no, so what happened, all that tax money that could have been generated went outside the city. When the poll was taken, people said they would drive to the outskirts of the city to shop at walmart if walmart couldn’t build within. I’m not positive but I think the poll was done by the Times, 5 or 6 months ago at most, when WM was fighting to get into NY....

Steve in Bedford, PA:  There you go again Steve...proving my point that you Wal-Mart folks just love your “polls.” Who did the polling Steve?  Was this a Wal-Mart commissioned poll?  If you noticed, I drew a distinction between a “poll” and a referendum.  Was there a referendum in New York like there was in Inglewood, California?

You whine about “the liberal city council.” What about when the “shoe is on the other foot” and it’s a conservative council that is wrapped around Wal-Mart’s little finger?  Do you cry foul just as loudly?

As far as getting facts from variety of sources-- if you don’t like the Berkeley studies, there are many other people that essentially finding the same things.  You might want to read the interview with Alan Tonelson.  Tonelson is a fellow at the United States Business and Industry Council, Tonelson is the author of “The Race to the Bottom: Why a Global Worker Surplus and Uncontrolled Free Trade are Sinking American Living Standards.”

Tom Boese
Field Producer - Wisconsin
Brave New Films

Tom,
anyone can find a poll or referendum to back their beliefs. I agree, walmart and conservative groups take polls and reports their results when they favor them, but you can’t say the unions or liberal groups do the exact same thing. You throw enough money to any group and you will gets the results you paid for. That’s why I choose not to believe any polls for either side.  All I was stating was what was printed in the NY Times a couple of months ago. Sorry if it goes against what you believe in.

Dear Tom Boese, Tom why even bother with people like Robert Springer, like our president, Walmart and all their executives are in denial.  Their mantra is When you are the biggest star in the sky, someones always out to get you.  They dont do anything wrong.  Lets talk about threats:  Lets see if you dont change your availability when they want you to they cut your hours, is that not a threat or is that more blackmail.  If you join a union or sign a union card as the anti union film SIGN NOW PAY LATER says you lose all your rights in or your voice in the company, well we dont have a voice now so what difference does it make.  Example:  Some of us are scheduled to come in Christmas night, WHY!.  Cause we have to convert over to basic merchandise, god forbid we miss a dollar.  It doesnt matter that we have a family coming in from out of town to have a nice dinner with and to open presents just make sure you are at Walmart at 10 pm christmas night.  Of course if you dont show up you get coached which in reality is a write up but when Walmart dont want to sound negative they use other words that make them sound fair and just.  Of course our competitors are letting their employees come in on Monday morning at 7 oclock so they can enjoy their christmas.  And I know what people are thinking, why does she stay there, well I like the people I work with and I have a lot of time invested, why should I leave cause this company has made money their god, discriminate against women and have lousy health benefits.  By the way Tom several of us at my store were interviewed for the movie by Caty Borum.

Kathleen:  Many of us feel your pain.  There should be no reason why anyone in the retail industry has to report to work on Christmas night.  Maybe we could get Robert Springer, Ellis Wyatt, jc, Lori, and bry in Rogers, AK to fill in for you since they all love Wal-Mart so much!  Oh, I forgot!  They will be busy enjoying time with their family or friends.

Hang in there Kathleen.  You shouldn’t have to feel like you have to leave your job at Wal-Mart if you have a lot of time invested.  Hopefully Wal-Mart will wake up and see the light before they ruin any more Christmases for their employees.  Hey--do you think any of the Walton clan would mind working at 10 PM on Christmas night?  Naw....I didn’t think so.

Tom Boese
Field Producer - Wisconsin
Brave New Films

kathleen,

Take another job somewhere else.  The economy is strong, you don’t like your job, and life is short. 

Enjoy your Christmas break with some extra time and start the New Year off with a new employer.  Any of those “people you like” that are truly your friend will continue to be when you move on up away from Wally.

Enjoy!

Dear John G,
Because worker rights are not respected by companies like Wal-Mart working somewhere else does not help. I don’t need to boire you with the details. Kathleen...you do have a real voice in the union because union culture has changed for the better. A union will also make sure that you get the pay and benefits for all of the hard work you do on behalf of Wal-Mart. If unions were so bad, as the video claims, why does Wal-Mart worry about it so much. If the workers want to pay someone money its thier business, not Wal-Mart’s.

Dear keith, Oh I know about unions.  I tried a campaign here but of course the people were scared of losing their jobs if they participated in any union activity.  Unless Im wrong, my understanding is that the NLRB under the Bush administration isnt as employee friendly.  You know if Walmart would just fix some of these things, we wouldnt need a union.  Why dont they read what the CEOs of other companies who are profiled here on this website say about, treating employees with respect and paying them a fair wage and keeping them happy.  In return employees would work their hearts out.  Which at one time is what me and alot of other long term employees would do and still do but Walmart wants to get rid of us because we are aging and unhealthy, of course the real reason is because they have to pay us what they think is a alot of money.  They dont care about loyalty or the quality of our work.  When the meat cutters in Crawford wanted to get a union, walmart started carrying packaged meat.  Management will tell you they will close a store down if they vote in a union and many people need their jobs no matter how small so they get scared and wont participate.

To all you people that will go to work christmas night.

A lot of people will work christmas day, all over this country--gas stations , fire fighters, police, hospital employees and many more.

Do any of you people do any shopping of any kind on christmas day, if you do then you are part of the reason those people are working. ( think about it )

Another company i worked for told me and others if we wanted our jobs we would work CHRISTMAS DAY, i worked for that company 15 years and walked away.

I know a lot about working holidays, after all i have been working for 46 years.

Anyone working in the retail world will have to bend a little, it’s always been that way.

The retail business will not change for anyone, if you hate it so much then do what i did, walk away.

Be thankful you have a job, and money to spend on christmas. (many all over the world dont )

MERRY CHRISTMAS

Kathleen that sucks, like they said maybe Lori or Robert will fill in for you since they worship Wal-Mao so much...don’t feel too bad the communists chinese slaves that make � of Wal-Maos stuff aren’t allowed to celebrate Christmas either. Why?

Because Wal-Mao mainly does business with a totalatarian government that denies its citizens freedom of religion.

Grandpa just because you allowed yourself to be suckered for so long doesn’t mean Kathleen should. Every human being deserves some measure of happiness.

I think if you truly love America you cannot not possible love Wal-Mao

“ a man cannot serve two masters for he will either love one and depise the other. Man cannot serve both God and Money”
Matthew

Keith,,
your saying union culture has changed for the better. Try telling GM or Ford workers who will be out of a job in the next few months due to the unions demanding to much. Last night on 60 minutes, they showed what the unions have done for the auto industry. Right now, there is only 2 cars American made that rank in the top 25 cars sold. This is due to the high cost of making them here, and the overall lack of reliability. My dad has always preached to me to buy Ford all my life, but this year he went and bought a Toyota since it is more reliable and less expensive. Out of the bottom 25 cars ranked by consumer reports and other mags, 24 of them were American made. That tells you alot right there what the unions have done to our auto industry. That could be why the UFCW is losing so many of its members the last few years, overinflated prices and shabby reliability due to the unons demanding too much…

And Sandra, you go on this big kick about how WM is only looking out for the money. You don’t really think the unions are looking out for the walmart associates, all they are looking out for is there dwindling numbers and union dues. The only time the unions acted like they care for the WM associates was when walmart got into grocery and starting cutting into the unions monopoly on grocery stores. That is why the unions don’t attack Target or Kmart right now, but once target gets more into grocery and hurts the unions, a Target watch will appear. Also, get off you Wal-mao kick, it was funny the first week, but the more you over use it, the less people will take your opionion seriously. Also mistaking the documented facts, “80% of walmart stuff is made in China”, when less then 20% comes from china does not help your credibility either. Stick to the facts and don’t rely on flatly false allegations created by the unions and you might do some good, but keep spouting the unions unproven falsehoods and you will be ignored by the massed, just like they are.

Tom said:
Maybe we could get Robert Springer, Ellis Wyatt, jc, Lori, and bry in Rogers, AK to fill in for you since they all love Wal-Mart so much! Oh, I forgot! They will be busy enjoying time with their family or friends.
Well Tom Walmart watch don’t like me posting and has blocked not one but two IP’s I post from but just to answer you and your repeated ill references to me I’ll go around the block again.
You see I would love to work for kathleen but the sad fact is I also must work on christmas eve and christmas day. you see when you sit down and turn on the boob tube on christmas instead of enjoying time with your family there is someone like me being taken away from their family on christmas day. Enjoy your television and forget about the thousands of people all over the United States that have to work just so you can watch it. As for your stupid movie unlike you I do no spend hard earned money on a cd (dvd) just to burn it in a bon fire. I make more of a statement by not giving you the money to begin with.
As for you Sandra I love my country and I like Walmart AND I love God. I do not worship money nor do I worship Walmart. Just because I like something that helps me to live within my means does not mean I worship it. Cut the extremist stuff and get with the facts. My bible tells me to help my fellow man and just because someone was not born in our country does not mean they are not my fellow man. With your anti china campaign you are doing the opposite of what GOD is telling you to do. Double check your bible does it tell you to only love Americans? If it does I think you are reading the wrong word of God.

Walmart had a hard time listening to the majority of the citizens of Helotes who, from the beginning, told them to go away. The green in the eyes of the pro council members ignored this, calling citizens in the ETJ of the city “outsiders”. One council member even stood to gain a windfall as his property was directly across from the proposed site, in an area the developers labelled on their maps as “future development” (but he assured everyone this was no conflict of interest).

Well, every pro Walmart council member that was up for re-election (including the mayor) was challenged by anti Walmart folks, and those folks, in the true spirit of Democracy, were elected by a majority of the voters.
The majority of the citizens of Helotes made their wishes known: WALMART GO AWAY!! With all the ‘good’ Walmart offers, we decided we’ll take our chances without big blue polluting our Helotes creek, flooding our small valley with 24 hour a day lights, increasing crime and snarling traffic. Not to mention the threatened/endangered creatures that exist on and near the proposed site (but I’ve noticed many pro development types have little regard for creatures other than humans if there is no possible financial gain).
Good bye Walmart!!

If WM was truly a “family friendly” company as they profess to be, NO ONE SHOULD HAVE TO WORK ON CHRISTMAS EVE NIGHT OR CHRISTMAS DAY, PERIOD!!!

The 24 hour Grocery Store where I worked for 7 years closed at 5pm on Thanksgiving and Christmas Eve and did not reopen until 6am the day after the holiday. We were paid for those holidays as a bonus too!

One would think that WM could be closed for 36 hours so that their employees could have that time with their families. But I guess that is not the case.

I also worked in the Hotel/Motel Industry for 3 years proir to going into the retail sector. I worked every Holiday in the calander year. It sucked. That is why I went back into retail. If I worked a Federal Holiday Christmas, New Years, Memorial Day, 4th of July, Labor Day, I was paid time and a half. I even could take my Birthday off with pay!.

Steve in Bedford,Pa

You’re drinking the Koolade that the media is serving the American public about unions and the auto industry.  To say that the lackluster showing of the American car companies is the fault of the unions is a convient excuse being used by incompetent executives who have mismanaged their companies. 

The workers put these products together and see that they are going out the door according to the job specifications given them by their superiors.  The people making the decsions on how these products are to be designed, built, marketed and serviced are not represented by the UAW or any other labor union. 

You state with authority that “Right now, there is only 2 cars American made that rank in the top 25 cars sold. This is due to the high cost of making them here, and the overall lack of reliability.” The high cost of making them here is not the fault of unions.  Unionized auto workers are paid almost identical per hour rates of pay as the non-union autoworkers.  The one difference between them is legacy costs.  These costs are the result of American based companies who have been “borrowing” from their employee pension plans for years without putting anything back. (ie:The congress and the social security system, Worldcom, Enron, etc) As a result, the day of reckoning has come for these incompetent executives to explain to the shareholders where the money has gone.  Union’s have made a convienent scapegoat.

As for your comments about reliablilty I accessed the following FACTS from the JD Power and Associates list of award winners for 2005

General Motors Corporation sweeps the North/South America plant quality awards. General Motors’ Oshawa #2, Ontario, Canada, plant, which produces the Buick Century, Buick LaCrosse and Pontiac Grand Prix, earns the Gold Plant Quality Award. The Oshawa #1, Ontario, and Hamtramck, Mich., plants earn the Silver and Bronze Plant Quality awards, respectively.

Highest Ranked Entry Midsize Car in Initial Quality Chevrolet Malibu/Malibu Maxx

Highest Ranked Full-Size Car in Initial Quality Buick LeSabre

Highest Ranked Full-Size SUV in Initial Quality Chevrolet Suburban

Highest Ranked Heavy Duty Full-Size Pickup in Initial Quality GMC Sierra HD

Highest Ranked Premium Midsize Car in Initial Quality Buick Century

Highest Ranked Light Duty Full-Size Pickup in Initial Quality Ford F-150 LD

Highest in Customer Satisfaction With Vocational Heavy Duty Diesel Engines Caterpillar C-15

Most Dependable Compact Car Chevrolet Prizm

Most Dependable Entry Luxury Car Ford Thunderbird

Most Dependable Entry Midsize Car Chevrolet Malibu

Most Dependable Full Size Car Buick LeSabre

Most Dependable Full-Size Sport Utility Vehicle GMC Yukon/Yukon XL

Most Dependable Full-Size Van Ford E-Series

Most Dependable Heavy-Duty Full-Size Pickup Chevrolet Silverado HD

Most Dependable Light-Duty Full-Size Pickup Cadillac Escalade EXT

Most Dependable Midsize Luxury Car Lincoln Town Car

Most Dependable Midsize Pickup Chevrolet S-10 Pickup

Most Dependable Midsize Van Ford Windstar

Most Dependable Premium Midsize Car Buick Century

Each of these plants and the respective vehicles are built by UAW represented autoworkers.  As you can see they have compiled a respectable record for quality and dependabilty.

I don’t fault you for what you said, I only feel bad that like so many Americans, you have been duped into thinking that if a automobile is Union made it must be inferior.  Nothing is further from the truth, as the facts show. 

Unions are the result of years of oppression by huge corporations who exploited human beings for their own monitary gain.  Being that I know someone who works for WM, I can tell that WM fits into that mold.

Thank you Rick innTN for saying what I have been trying to about Unions....American workers need them now more than ever!! We drive UAW made cars. Always have!!

My husband is UAW also!! I am passionate with him in getting the word out that though Unions have made many strides forward for workers. The anti-Union people on this blog take one or two mistakes that have been made in the past to paint the entire picture of Unions to be the great Evil since the Soviet Union.

THANK YOU RICK!

Steve said:
“GM or Ford workers who will be out of a job in the next few months due to the unions demanding to much.”
“the UFCW is losing so many of its members the last few years, overinflated prices and shabby reliability due to the unons demanding too much…”
You know what I don’t understand about idiots like you? Why is it that when workers try to get a raise or better benefits it’s bad but when but when CEO’s or anyone in managment gets a raise that is fine. Let’s blame the people who work for a paycheck and not even think about the guy who just bought a third house with his seven figure salary. The only time you blame bosses is when they are union bosses. Why would shabby reliability have anything to do with the union? Maybe it has to do with poor designs? Maybe managment should take a pay cut to make sure the prices of their cars aren’t too high. How can you feel good about blaming middle-class workers for shitty cars while fucking rich assholes pull the strings above them from their corner office. Shitheads like you think corporations are never at fault but unions are always to blame. Yes, there are shitty unions. There are also thousands of terrible corporations. Maybe if you would pull your head out of your ass and realize that you can’t blame unions for everything. Are unions to blame for problems in the airline industry? No, it’s fucking bad managment. Trying to say unions don’t help out workers is like saying corporations don’t make money.

Rick

I don’t doubt that the JD Power survey you quoted is accurate. However, that means nothing compared to sales, prices, costs and customer attitudes. Toyota, Honda, Hyundai and Nissan are selling like hotcakes here and Toyota may have outsold GM for 2005. We will have to see. In 2004, Toyota profited $12.4 billion. The Japanese and Koreans build in the US the cars they sell in the US. Honda also had a record profit year in 2004. Meanwhile, GM and Ford are heading for bankruptcy.

I agree that corporate mismanagement has plagued Detroit. A lot of that has to do with building boring, poor quality, high mileage vehicles. A lot of it has to do with giving in to ridiculous union wage and benefit demands. When Detroit could pass those costs along to the consumer in the form of higher prices, everything was fine. The only people who got the shaft were the customers. Now, Japan and Korea have stormed US shores and are making high quality cars at good prices. Their cars are stylish, good on gas, reliable and they hold their value. You can’t say the same for most US cars. Let me give you an example. I have a 2002 US car. My girlfriend has a 2003 Toyota. She has 93,000 miles on her car and she abuses it. I have 26,000 on mine and I am good to it, in terms of mileage, handling and maintenance. Yet, her car runs like a champ and has never had a SINGLE problem. Mine has had problems left and right and will probably have more soon. My car was slightly more than hers but hers runs better, lasts longer, looks better, gets better mileage, is easier to maintain and holds its’ value better. How can you argue with those facts?

The name of the game in the auto business is sales and profits. Quality/Reliability/Price/Reputation/Service=Sales. Cost Control/Sales=Profit.

Do you really believe it is just a conincidence that US auto makers are struggling and foreign auto makers are raking in the dough? US Auto companies are union; foreign are not. Is that a coincidence?

Not too terribly difficult, is it?

Ellis said:
“Do you really believe it is just a conincidence that US auto makers are struggling and foreign auto makers are raking in the dough? US Auto companies are union; foreign are not. Is that a coincidence? Not too terribly difficult, is it?”

Well it seems pretty difficult for you. 

In your whole article you never explained how the union employees affected the quality of American cars. You said how foreign cars are far superior in every sense, and you are right. That is the biggest reason they are successful and Detroit isn’t. Also, most American car plants are only equiped to build one type of model not multiple like Honda, Nissa and Toyota. All of this has nothing to do with the Union. It sounds more like a management problem to me. In fact, wages in US Auto plants and foreign plants in the US are almost identical. Both around $20-30/hr depending on the region.

Sniff, Sniff.  I smell an awful lot like David in Zack, AR. 

Hey Ellis, better check to make sure your car wasn’t made in Mexico or Canada.  You are still a huge idiot, you make the case that buying an American car is foolish because American union workers make them, yet you buy an American car.  Just an FYI, your imaginary girlfriends car was likely made by Americans too.  Crappy cars start with crappy design.  You can’t expect assembly line workers, union or not, to make poop smell better.  Well maybe they can make it smell better, but its still poop.

Kathleen,

I’m sorry that you have to work on Christmas evening.  I know I would hate that as well.  But, that comes with the territory of working in retail...or television, radio, newspapers, hospitals, fire departements, police departments, gas stations, etc.  It sounds like you must like your job quite a lot in order to put up with everything you claim to.  Be thankful that you do have a job, a roof over your head, a warm coat in the cold, food in your belly, and a wonderful family to enjoy.

Remember all of the families in the gulf coast that have none of those things...that still have family members unaccounted for.  Remember the hundreds of Wal-Mart associates still unaccounted for.  Remember Wal-Mart’s overwhelming response to help the victims of Katrina and Rita...help that is still coming in.  Remember the 600 Wal-Mart associates that are flying from all areas of the company to work in the hard hit areas.  They are coming in for 3 weeks at a time; living in a make-shift dormitory in a Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market that was supposed to open in November.  They are doing this not just for the supposed “all-mighty $”; but so the stores can provide goods and services these communities need so desparately now.  I think everyone here should be thankful for what they have...rather than complaning about what they don’t have.

Finally...to Sandra Monday

WOW...in one full swoop you’ve managed to call me unamerican and an worshiper of money, who does not love God.

I’ll try to remember that the next time I cry when I hear the Star Spangled Banner...or when I sing along with Lee Greenwood to God Bless America...or when I mourn the loss of innocent lives lost in an attack on our country..or the lives of our lost soldiers.

I know I won’t be thinking about it the next time I’m in prayer.  You see, I do pray and worship...but only the true King...Jesus.  I have my priorities in order...God, family, and then work.  And, God is in every area of my life...including work.  I would point out that the Word also says, “do everything as if unto the Lord”.  I work with the ethics, enthusiasm, ingenuity, and joy I would have if I was doing it for Jesus...not for the almighty dollar.

As many of you may have guessed, I am also a Wal-Mart associate.  I am tired of hearing from the union workers complaning about my company...focus on your own employers.  I am tired of only hearing the sad stories from the disgruntled employees...every company has unhappy workers.  Tom Boese--why don’t you talk to some happy Wal-Mart associates..surely there are some with over 1 million of them around the globe. 

I would love to tell my story.  I am a single mother...not on any kind of government assistance at all.  I do have health insurance...and have had it from the moment I started working here.  My child also has health insurance...mind you again, not anything from the government.  His father pays for it...as required by law here.  I do believe I have a few other benefits as a Wal-Mart associate.  Let’s see, I do have a discount card, which is quite a money saver; I also have paid vacation; paid personal days; paid sick days; and paid bereavement days.  And the bereavement days are for real...I had to use them a few months ago when my mother passed away.  Besides not having to worry about going to work, I probably had between 15-20 of my co-workers come to my mother’s funeral (during the workday) to support me..a member of the Wal-Mart family.  Besides the beautiful plant they sent, they donated money to the Susan G. Komen Foundation in honor of my mother.  Now...back to the measurable benefits...I get a Christmas bonus, an incentive bonus, profit sharing, 401 K contributions, and they contribute to my stock purchases.  I could continue on and on, but I don’t think you really want to know the truth Tom.  If you did, you would talk to one of us.  By the way, I am an hourly associate..not one of the so-called “spin-control managers”.  And, I do support myself and my son with the “poverty” wages you are always talking about. 

“Our purpose in life is to love, serve, and add value to those we meet, “ George Fraser.

Kathy,

Are you in Aiken, South Carolina ? They have already started moving stuff there. The Christmas displays ( trees & stuff) are down.  Are all the walmarts doing that ? It seems very ‘unChristmassy’ . There aren’t any displays of the trees they are still selling. I have never seen a store do that.

I am sorry you guys have to be there at christmas eve. I don’t buy anything on a holiday unless I absolutely need it. I have worked enough holidays.

“ But, that comes with the territory of working in retail...or television, radio, newspapers, hospitals, fire departements, police departments, gas stations, etc. “
No, it doesn’t. As long as there is a pharmacy & a place people can buy food, stores don’t need to be open. One Sunday night in Canada I needed some OTC medicine, we had to go to the hospital pharmacy because everything was closed.  This was in one of the largest cites in the country.  It used to be that many stores were closed on Christmas eve or at the least closed by 11am or 12.  Years back many people closed for a whole week.  Of course most businesses was closed on Sundays. People were used to it and prepared.

I have worked retail. Someone coming in and moving merchandise or signs on Christmas is not necessary. With a little thought , it could be taken care of before closing. As a customer, I HATE it when they move the merchandise . It makes after christmas shopping that much more of a headache. Nothing is where it was. You don’t know if it is sold or just relocated.  The employees don’t know if they have something because it is moved daily. They are too busy moving merchandise to help you.
I used to enjoy after Christmas shopping. But it has become a real pain. Not because of the crowds, but due to management.

Tara, I am glad you have it so nice.  The employees I haev talked to worked very hard during Christmas. They did not get any kind of bonus and only had Christmas day off.

Union Gives Empty Presents to Kids
Union Activists true nature: making little children cry.  I hope everyone has read the Washington Times story of how union activists recently handed out empty presents to children at a Wal-Mart causing the poor little kids to cry. 

Just goes to show you unions will do anything - even hurt children.

Read the story here:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/op-ed/20051219-093818-6601r.htm

Washington Times, Dec 20, 2005
Columnist: Joel Mowbray

Listen to you all bicker and gripe.  I do not work for wal-mart, but I live in wal-mart land.  All of you should open your eyes and point out the good that it has done.  Sure, I hate the traffic in NWA now, but our economy is booming.  And in all these small towns that wal-mart has “invaded”, many people who DIDN’T have jobs, are now working.  This is 2006 and we all need to admit it, it’s a corporate world.  If wal-mart wasn’t there, some other corporate devil would be.  I have lots of friends that work for vendors, and if it wasn’t for wally world, they would be out of work.  All that matters is that people are working and not living off of the government.  So, I’m taking up for a company, who like any OTHER corp. has the bad, but just once look at what it can do for your community and family.  FOOD ON THE TABLE!!